[spectre] quick LInz discussion summary
Sally Jane NORMAN
norman@wanadoo.fr
Thu, 6 Sep 2001 21:11:47 +0200
C'est un message de format MIME en plusieurs parties.
------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C13718.AB19C4A0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Dear Spectres
Wrote this in a train before being able to pick up on your latest round of
mail, so will send it kind of in parallel and apologies for the overlap with
other stuff. It's a rather hasty resume...
A small bunch of us managed to get together in Linz, « en ordre dispersé »,
and below is some quick feedback on items discussed (likewise not in any
order of priority). Those in Linz (not all could attend the spectral thing
we called a meeting, but we got some input from people on the way out and
some output from the people on the way in) were Andreas, Annick, Walter,
Nina, Honor, Melentie, Diana, SJN, Lorenzo, Mare Tralla (un unofficial
Spectre recently dropped from the Syndicate list no doubt for mechanical
reasons, who would like to become a solid spectre).
- Current membership
Given Syndicate’s initial aims with regard to « deep Europe », the current
spectre list seems to have a heavy cultural « west (« shallow »??) Europe »
bias. This makes building future activity on the lines of past aims
hazardous, to say the least. Several spectres have already expressed the
need to relay information about spectre to people unaware of its existence,
and dissatisfied with current syndicate activity. At the same time, we have
to clarify ideas about our goals when answering new subscriber requests, so
as not to turn our entrance gate into a flood gate. We perhaps need to think
about numbers and group dynamics and representation (what do we represent
? – is Andreas’s proposal of a fortnight ago a valid starting point?) Given
that a spectre announcement on syndicate might trigger a flood of demands –
who knows ? Most of us can’t really identify the profile of the current
syndicate list.
- Analysis of what led up to this
A few people have explicitly said they’d like to analyse Syndicate’s recent
evolution, which is probably quite unique as an online community experience
; reviewing this should enable us to move on more firmly. Janos and Eric
have shown interest, perhaps others are keen – Geert ? Michael ? - to try
and build up some kind of shareable picture of this pretty complex
situation. The list demographics seemed to change radically in 99 around and
during the « off-the-record (non-archived) » war period, and we didn’t ever
really take stock afterwards of who we were, therefore who we were talking
to. Would it be possible/ easy to get hold of statistics as to numbers
joining and leaving at and since that period ? The population explosion and
transformation might give us clues as to how the list was evolving. And help
contextualise this whole thing with a bit more insight and objectivity. And
help us think about what kind of subscriber carryover from syndicate to
spectre is desirable.
- Announcements => information sharing
There was consensus about the usefulness of posting practical information
about our own and immediate environment activities, since this testifies to
what many of us actually do. Perhaps the recent announcement overload was
caused at least in part by demographic changes –meaning that syndicate was
just seen as a billboard. But the need to adequately contextualise «
announcements » - so that they really can be directly related to media
practices and experiences – was also emphasised. Many people favour the «
report » type of post – feeding in not just basic info about an upcoming or
just-over event, but contextualising it as cultural/ media practice, and
thinking twice about who this info is going out to and why. I.e. respecting
the specific community being addressed. Something it was hard to do in
recent syndicate times. The term « information sharing » was put on the
table - ok it’s flakey to change a term and hope that practices will change
miraculously - but in this case, renaming simply in our own minds maybe
makes sense.
- Translation
Building up a corpus of texts/ thinking specific to and for the list. If one
of our goals is « to host discussions and critical commentary about the
development of art, culture and politics in Europe », perhaps we could start
to try and pool some critical thinking from this deeper Europe we identify
with. Including and in particular seeing how to make thinking from « deep »
Europe accessible in various languages. There’s been quite a bit of ad hoc
translation over the years, we all know how labour intensive – and
ultimately irreplaceable - this is. Perhaps we could try to structure/ group
a bunch of textual resources (possibly including our own syndicate/ spectre
analysis ?), that better reflect our « deep » and diversified ethics ?
Without wide-eyed naivete, we can also check out various funding/
translation possibilities offered within and beyond national and European
institutions.
- Funding
Those who know the ropes of different funding structures can contribute
valuable knowledge to others : collectively we’re familiar with certain
transnational bodies and with private structures (Soros, Langlois…) that may
be able to meet certain needs. No wide-eyed illusions, just sharing of
specific know-how for those who require it. E.g. the translation thing could
probably tap into a number of different funding schemes.
- Opening up to younger participation on the list
Before we become geriatric spectres, and without being demagogical or
turning into a deep europe babysitting agency, it would be good to see how
to involve younger people in the deep Europe identity we choose to adopt and
live and explore. Some of us work regularly in situations with students for
example, but they will probably only grasp the meaning of a group and an
ethics like ours via contact with others of their generation. Those
concerned with this question could identify events and opportunities for
encounters between younger people from the countries we live in. They may
have approaches to issues like language and community that are very
different to our own, offering unexpected solutions and strategies.
Catalysing a « deep europe » sensibility that is not just benetton or EU
apologetic rhetoric probably requires thinking in terms of face-to-face
encounters.
- Developing activities that get beyond the language barrier
Sound and image activities could be a good counterweight to our
verbiage-driven mailing list and critical theorising, and can be inspiring
when they uphold a « deep europe » identity – as in the acoustic space lab
project. Radio and image streaming are activities that push spectra to their
limits in good ways. We have competence in these areas within the group that
shouldn’t be forgotten. It may or may not link with the previous item (young
people).
- Listing and pooling available technical resources
All the above-described activities quickly go beyond mailing list resources,
but some of them could be boosted by other online tools. Not all of this
interests everyone, so perhaps we could establish an inventory of tools that
individuals on the list can tap into quite readily and make available to
others. The spectre chat was a good example. Maybe there’s a resource list
(billboards, chat spaces, streaming slots, whatever – sorry non-tech
chimpanzee talking here) that could be jointly created, to facilitate and
encourage exchange. The idea of a regular chat slot was mentioned.
voilà. I'll get back soon with also response to Ars-type scenes - they make
it acutely obvious that there's a burning need for places where real debate
and engagement about the issues we're concerned with. Coz it sure as heck
wasn't Linz.
love to all
sjn
------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C13718.AB19C4A0
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4134.600" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" =
size=3D3></FONT>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>Dear Spectres</P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN class=3D717460419-06092001>Wrote this in a =
train before=20
being able to pick up on your latest round of mail, so will send it kind =
of in=20
parallel and apologies for the overlap with other stuff. It's a rather =
hasty=20
resume...</SPAN> <?xml:namespace prefix =3D o ns =3D=20
"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>A small bunch of us managed to get together in =
Linz,=20
=AB en ordre dispers=E9 =BB, and below is some quick feedback =
on items=20
discussed (likewise not in any order of priority). Those in Linz =
(not all=20
could attend the spectral thing we called a meeting, but we got some =
input from=20
people on the way out and some output from the people on the way in) =
were=20
Andreas, Annick, Walter, Nina, Honor, Melentie, Diana<SPAN=20
class=3D717460419-06092001>,</SPAN> S<SPAN =
class=3D717460419-06092001>JN</SPAN>,=20
Lorenzo, Mare Tralla (un unofficial Spectre recently dropped from the =
Syndicate=20
list no doubt for mechanical reasons, who would like to become a solid=20
spectre).</P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> -<SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New =
Roman'"> =20
</SPAN>Current membership</P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>Given Syndicate’s initial aims with regard to =
=AB deep=20
Europe =BB, the current spectre list seems to have a heavy cultural =
=AB west (=AB shallow =BB??) Europe =BB bias. This =
makes building=20
future activity on the lines of past aims hazardous, to say the least. =
Several=20
spectres have already expressed the need to relay information about =
spectre to=20
people unaware of its existence, and dissatisfied with current syndicate =
activity. At the same time, we have to clarify ideas about our goals =
when=20
answering new subscriber requests, so as not to turn our entrance gate =
into a=20
flood gate. We perhaps need to think about numbers and group dynamics =
and=20
representation (what do we represent ? – is Andreas’s =
proposal of a=20
fortnight ago a valid starting point?) Given that a spectre announcement =
on=20
syndicate might trigger a flood of demands – who knows ? Most =
of us can’t=20
really identify the profile of the current syndicate list. </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>-<SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New =
Roman'"> =20
</SPAN>Analysis of what led up to this</P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>A few people have explicitly said they’d like =
to analyse=20
Syndicate’s recent evolution, which is probably quite unique as an =
online=20
community experience ; reviewing this should enable us to move on =
more=20
firmly. Janos and Eric have shown interest, perhaps others are keen =
–=20
Geert ? Michael ? - to try and build up some kind of shareable =
picture=20
of this pretty complex situation. The list demographics seemed to change =
radically in 99 around and during the =AB off-the-record=20
(non-archived) =BB war period, and we didn’t ever really take =
stock=20
afterwards of who we were, therefore who we were talking to. Would it be =
possible/ easy to get hold of statistics as to numbers joining and =
leaving at=20
and since that period ? The population explosion and transformation =
might=20
give us clues as to how the list was evolving. And help contextualise =
this whole=20
thing with a bit more insight and objectivity.<SPAN=20
style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>And help us think about what =
kind of=20
subscriber carryover from syndicate to spectre is desirable.</P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>-<SPAN class=3D717460419-06092001> =
</SPAN>Announcements =3D>=20
information sharing</P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>There was consensus about the usefulness of posting =
practical=20
information about our own and immediate environment activities, since =
this=20
testifies to what many of us actually do. Perhaps the recent =
announcement=20
overload was caused at least in part by demographic changes =
–meaning that=20
syndicate was just seen as a billboard. But the need to adequately =
contextualise=20
=AB announcements =BB - so that they really can be directly =
related to=20
media practices and experiences – was also emphasised. Many people =
favour the=20
=AB report =BB type of post – feeding in not just basic =
info about an=20
upcoming or just-over event, but contextualising it as cultural/ media =
practice,=20
and thinking twice about who this info is going out to and why. I.e. =
respecting=20
the specific community being addressed. Something it was hard to do in =
recent=20
syndicate times. The term =AB information sharing =BB was put =
on the table=20
- ok it’s flakey to change a term and hope that practices will =
change=20
miraculously - but in this case, renaming simply in our own minds maybe =
makes=20
sense.</P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> -<SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New =
Roman'"> =20
</SPAN>Translation</P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>Building up a corpus of texts/ thinking specific to =
and for=20
the list. If one of our goals is =AB to host discussions and =
critical=20
commentary about the development of art, culture and politics in =
Europe =BB,=20
perhaps we could start to try and pool some critical thinking from this =
deeper=20
Europe we identify with. Including and in particular seeing how to make =
thinking=20
from =AB deep =BB Europe accessible in various languages. =
There’s been=20
quite a bit of ad hoc translation over the years, we all know how labour =
intensive – and ultimately irreplaceable - this is. Perhaps we =
could try to=20
structure/ group a bunch of textual resources (possibly including our =
own=20
syndicate/ spectre analysis ?), that better reflect our =
=AB deep =BB=20
and diversified ethics ?<SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> =20
</SPAN>Without wide-eyed naivete, we can also check out various funding/ =
translation possibilities offered within and beyond national and =
European=20
institutions. </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> - Funding</P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>Those who know the ropes of different funding =
structures can=20
contribute valuable knowledge to others : collectively we’re =
familiar with=20
certain transnational bodies and with private structures (Soros, =
Langlois…) that=20
may be able to meet certain needs. No wide-eyed illusions, just sharing =
of=20
specific know-how for those who require it. E.g. the translation thing =
could=20
probably tap into a number of different funding schemes. </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> -<SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New =
Roman'"> =20
</SPAN>Opening up to younger <SPAN =
class=3D717460419-06092001>participation=20
on the list</SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>Before we become geriatric spectres, and without =
being=20
demagogical or turning into a deep europe babysitting agency, it would =
be good=20
to see how to involve younger people in the deep Europe identity we =
choose to=20
adopt and live and explore. Some of us work regularly in situations with =
students for example, but they will probably only grasp the meaning of a =
group=20
and an ethics like ours via contact with others of their generation. =
Those=20
concerned with this question could identify events and opportunities for =
encounters between younger people from the countries we live in. They =
may have=20
approaches to issues like language and community that are very different =
to our=20
own, offering unexpected solutions and strategies. Catalysing a =
=AB deep=20
europe =BB sensibility that is not just benetton or EU apologetic =
rhetoric=20
probably requires thinking in terms of face-to-face encounters.</P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>- Developing activities that get beyond the =
language=20
barrier</P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>Sound and image activities could be a <SPAN=20
class=3D717460419-06092001>good </SPAN>counterweight to =
our <SPAN=20
class=3D717460419-06092001>verbiage-driven </SPAN>mailing list and =
critical=20
theorising, and can be inspiring when they uphold a =AB deep =
europe =BB=20
identity – as in the acoustic space lab project. Radio and image =
streaming are=20
activities that push spectra to their limits in good ways. We have =
competence in=20
these areas within the group that shouldn’t be forgotten. It =
may or may not=20
link with the previous item (young people).<SPAN=20
style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN style=3D"mso-spacerun: yes"></SPAN> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>-<SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT: 7pt 'Times New =
Roman'"> =20
</SPAN>Listing and pooling available technical resources </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal>All the above-described activities quickly go =
beyond mailing=20
list resources, but some of them could be boosted by other online tools. =
Not all=20
of this interests everyone, so perhaps we could establish an inventory =
of tools=20
that individuals on the list can tap into quite readily and make =
available to=20
others. The spectre chat was a good example. Maybe there’s a =
resource list=20
(billboards, chat spaces, streaming slots, whatever – sorry =
non-tech chimpanzee=20
talking here) that could be jointly created, to facilitate and encourage =
exchange. The idea of a regular chat slot was mentioned. </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN class=3D717460419-06092001>voil=E0. I'll get =
back soon with=20
also response to Ars-type scenes - they make it acutely obvious that =
there's a=20
burning need for places where real debate and engagement about the =
issues we're=20
concerned with. Coz it sure as heck wasn't Linz.</SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN class=3D717460419-06092001></SPAN> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN class=3D717460419-06092001>love to =
all</SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN class=3D717460419-06092001></SPAN> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN class=3D717460419-06092001>sjn</SPAN></P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN class=3D717460419-06092001></SPAN> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal> </P>
<P class=3DMsoNormal><o:p></o:p> </P></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
------=_NextPart_000_0039_01C13718.AB19C4A0--